Loading 7.62x25

Reloading
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I did some load development, loaded on a single stage and all. Which doesn’t happen often enough these days! Got TT-33 shooting to very high 1200fps (almost 1300) using 70N (yes, I still have a stash) and Hornady 90gr jacketed bullets (#31000).

Load data was a bit of a challange, I could have easily (educated) guessed a starting point, but I did get access to Quickload model data, which in hindsight was off and VERY over estimated, but safe.

4.x gr at around 900-1020fps, failed entirely or struggled cycle the gun.
5.2gr at around 1212fps - VERY pleasant shooter.
5.5gr at around 1282fps (one round cracked 1300fps) - also VERY pleasant shooter, but definitely feeling more oomph and muzzle climb. More pushy than snappy.

Both very easy to shoot and reasonably accurate. Actually, I really enjoy shooting that firearm, a lot. Military loads are around 1400fps, so I am almost there, really keen to see how they shoot. However, I am convinced that there’s also a sweet spot somewhere between 5.2 and 5.5 that I might look at, because I really want to shoot it in a Service match with it.

Mold received, I am going to crank out some DIY bullets, shooting jacketed is not sustainable. And brass… Oh boy… Not exactly cheap or common, I got enough to keep me going very casually, but not if I want to shoot a match and account for 5% brass loss. Apparently it’s possibly to form brass from 223 cases. Cut, form, ream to reduce brass thickness on the neck. I ordered 7.7mm and 7.6mm drill bits to test the theory… I have some 223 to play with. Hopefully it works well, in which case I will buy a few killos of 223 and work with them.

We shall see how that goes, if it works, I’ll be pretty happy with it.

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p.s. didn’t look like I had any unburnt powder, which is great, but I am also keen to test this out with AP50N. Will most likely be more snappy than ‘pushy’, but there’s definitely potential there for higher velocities if I can’t safely get into mid 1400fps range with 70N.

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I have some data from my CZ52 I can send you, but wouldn’t recommend the top loads in the TT-33. Highest velocity I got was 1650fps with 7.7gr of Power Pistol behind a cast 90gr projectile, that gun throws the brass a good 15 meters!

What mold did you get?

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Thanks, @Cavallino

If you have anything for AP50N or AP70N, I’d love to see it. Not sure Power Pistol powder is something I could find here.

Mold I got: Lee 311-93-1R 90300.

I think the hotter loads were alway intended to be used in the PPSH and then just handed down to the grunts, because Soviet handgun doctrine was really more of a ‘last resort’ than functional firearm to be used when appropriate.

Anyhow, would love to see some load data. Personally, aiming for 1400fps give or take, to see how it goes, maybe a bit slower than mid-1400 (probably low 1400s) on account of heavier bullet.

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CZ52 Data
CZ52 Data851×456 29.8 KB

The above data was tested and chronographed in my CZ52, use it at your own risk, haven’t got around to testing AP50 yet. The hotter ammo was definitely for the PPSH subguns but was safe in the CZ52, very unsafe in the Tokarevs. Will post some photos of the projectile later tonight.

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photo 2
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photo 3
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Also this is from the Sierra Manual.

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Thanks @Cavallino, much appreciated.

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It’s interesting seeing all the “Don’t use these loads in a TT-33!” disclaimers because my understanding is the TT-33 is at least as strong as the CZ-52. There’s some informative threads on US discussion forums from people who’ve looked into it and come to the conclusion the TT-33 may even be stronger than the CZ-52 in some respects.

Obviously I wouldn’t be trying to create some sort of 7.62x25mm +P ultra-hot homebrew load to use in a TT-33, though.

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Do you have any links to share? It would be an interesting read.

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Here’s a few threads to start you off:

https://www.gunboards.com/threads/cz-52-vs-tt-33.69456/

https://www.gunboards.com/threads/tokarev-tt33-or-cz-52-whichis-better.188597/

https://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?370396-What-s-the-deal-with-7-62x25-Tokarev

There’s some interesting discussions it out there; I’m certainly of the understanding the TT-33 (which is essentially a Colt M1903/M1911 hybrid) is stronger overall than the CZ-52.

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My disclaimer is regarding the load data not the firearm, I’ve tested the load data in a known manufacture CZ52 and not a Tokarev or a PPSH for that matter. I believe the problem with the Tokarev is that they were copied so much, potentially in expedient war time manufacture, that all manufacturing standards were not adhered to.

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Link below is to the mold that I have, drops right on 90 grains and .313" with 92,6,2 hardball alloy.

My barrel slugs at a flyshit under .311", so I size to .311" after 2 coats of Hi-Tec coating, had to make a customer expander to suit.

Also I crimp with the Lee factory crimp die, which is the collet style one with no carbide size ring in the bottom.

Arsenal 90gr Mold

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It’s not so much you as most the published load data I’ve found on the internet contains the “CZ-52 only, reduce by X% for TT-33” disclaimer (or something similar), even though the TT-33 is a solid gun that uses the Browning swinging link, same as the M1911.

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Don’t know, I wouldn’t be game enough to try. But holding both side by side, there’s definitely a lot of extra material on 1911

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@Martini - you got one yet?

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Maaaaaaaybe :smiley:

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go on…

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I might have one and I might be waiting for some components to arrive so I can work up a load for it :stuck_out_tongue:

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Work up a load? What? Nobody has time to mess around with powders and propellents! LMAO

What bullets are you using? I went with Hornady #31000 to get me going, but also bought a .311 mold, which will be the actual approach (jacketed bullets are not cheap).

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Like I said, I have access to Unique powder so I’ve got starting loads already available :smiley:

I have acquired a significant number of jacketed bullets for a pretty reasonable price and I’m leaning on someone with casting gear to cast some for me as well, so once that’s sorted I can settle on my “standard” load and make up ammo accordingly.