Amid the crazy shit going on now is probably not the time. But what the hell there’s no time like the present!
My question, is the firearms registry still relevant in 2020. My thoughts are a hard no and I’ll explain. But what I want is a broader discussion on the subject, how all shooters feel about it not just myself. Does anyone no how many PTAs are serviced every year and revenue is generated annually? Are the public getting there safety that little Johnny and the states yerned to give them?Repealing the registry Is it the first step to dismantle or undermine the NFA because we all know the NFA is not relevant in 2020.
In the data I’ve researched the firearms registry has shown no decrease in criminal activity with the use of firearms since its inception
Data has shown to have not stopped or lessened the the ability for mass shooters to carry out their intended crimes
If you’ve been around a while, you would see the flaws, missing firearms, sold firearms that were not remove from a persons permit, firearms that have had permitted legal mods removed from owners, lack of firearms and industry knowledge and the list goes on. The system is flawed and inefficient.
it’s sole existence was created to pave the way for more restrictions, knowing what we have, where we keep it, how we use it, and how they can’t take it.
transfer fees, licensing fees, PTA fees are just another tax on your hobby or sport. We don’t see this sort of tax in other sports or hobbies all enabled by a registry.
it only infringes upon the personal choices of licenced firearms owners the most responsible, heavily restricted civies in the country.
Eg caliber, action type, mag capacity, need not say more!
Now these are just a few things of the top of my head, there are many more things that disgust me when it comes to the firearms registry. I think we deserve much more credit than we are given for having to deal with such a poorly run atrocious control mechanism.
Let me know how you feel as a shooter in 2020 No wrong answers just want to know how peeps feel
I kind of agree, i don’t really care one way or the other if they have a record or “registry” of who has what gun, i don’t think it does us any harm and in reality if a gun gets in a crims hands they can theoretically see where it came from. BUT they way it’s done with this whole PTA system is just a ridiculous waste of everyones time and money. It costs us time and money to apply, and it costs them more then they make from a pta to process it, plus here in Qld they’re several years behind and really have no idea who has what, some records are up to date, some are unprocessed and some are just nowhere on their system (and i’ve seen this first hand). So really the pta thing should just be recognised as a failed experiment and ditched.
IMO the best system (of compromise) would be if you have a licence you can go in and buy any gun in your licence category on the spot over the counter. when you buy the gun gun the dealer can send off a form to whatever weapons branch saying Joe Bloggs just bought this gun with this serial number, and that’s all they should need.
Pretty bloody simple really.
@JSS I feel you the PTA is the most immensely floored part of the entire system. it really serves no purpose other than for a law abiding adult to ask permission if they can have something.
I agree, I mean its not like they ever knocked me back on a permit and ive put in a few (around 70 odd maybe more) the send off a letter would save time and money for them. Its not like they get it right either, I bought a shotgun off of a bloke you all know, he bought it from an LGS, paid for a permit, had had it for a few years, had had an inspection even. when we went to transfer it the dealer says sorry this guns never been registered, we’ll have to hang onto it and amnesty register it for you.
Yes 100% a mate of mine lately got a phone call to go to the lgs from police they wouldn’t tell him what it was in regards to, so we went down to see what it was all about. Lgs owner handed old mate an UO Boito shotgun, in disbelief he said what the fuck is this I already have one of these in the safe at home. the Police dropped it off earlier an said it was your gun and they seized it from another local gun shop which was closed due to the owners wife having mental health issues. Old mate had dropped it at the said gun shop for repairs and distributor just replaced and a new PTA to be done for the acquisition. Afterwards he called the police and registry to say he had already an identical shotgun, the response from the registry was that mistakes happen and they can’t be on top of everything with such a large case load. So know he has to identical firearms with serials one hundred numbers a part. Best Thing is that the gun shop repaired the old one hehe
I think that some sort of method of tracking firearms isn’t really a bad thing. Look at that dodgy gun shop for example, it was up in North Qld or maybe Darwin (i can’t remember) who got busted selling guns illegally to local criminals, if there was absolutely no tracking method then he could have been selling his entire inventory on a daily basis to unlicenced people without anyone knowing.
If they got rid of the PTA system they would be able to better focus on keeping a simple record system up to date just like when you buy a car, way more cars in the country than guns and they keep track of them just fine.
The registry itself isn’t the problem, it’s the stupid system they’ve got for us to purchase guns that sucks and causes all the problems on both sides.
Such method exists. Guns have serial numbers and records are ket at source and destinations. So there are always overlapping records… Registry is redundant in this equation and I would say extremely dangerous. I don’t have the time right now to write an essay on topic, but I have been slowly in my notes… Believe it or not, I actually know a little bit about data security and this is like 101 of nopes.
Anyway, I will eventually write a post on this and drop it here. However, records exist, they can be accessed via legal means if needed (in all countries), they just don’t (read: must not) need to be centralised.
I know what you’re saying as far as security of the data but personally i’d rather take that risk than to make it easier for guns to be sold to people who shouldn’t have them.
Don’t forget all the things we go through to get a licence don’t really guarantee that someone isn’t just a criminal who hasn’t been caught or charged with anything yet, i wonder how many guns they could buy & resell to anyone without being caught if there wasn’t a central system of data? How do you think most of the ammo gets into the wrong hands in Australia? It doesn’t get imported like many of the illegal guns do. it gets bought by someone with a licence and then passed on.
Madmen no, but crooks yes. There’s a bloke who goes to my LGS who did 8 years for armed bank robbery, he has a licence now. I’m not saying he’s a crook anymore, but if a bloke with a conviction like that can get a licence, a bloke who is an active crook without a conviction can get a licence as easy as you or i can.
I think we need to realise that not everyone is upstanding, and personally i’d rather it was easier to catch them out if they’re dabbling in the gun trade, in a way that doesn’t make our lives hell as LAFOs.
Hey mate I fully understand your stand point and not disagreeing with your views because they are yours and I respect that. But over the years I’ve came to realise that we cant treat people in society like they are going to engage in criminal activity, or pre empt this in any way! If you segregate and treat law abiding folk like criminals for long enough while enforcing restriction eventually you will force the hand of the most law loving individuals into engaging in criminal behaviour.
I agree completely and i don’t wanted to be treated like a criminal or even mildly disrupted when i want to buy a gun (or anything else for that matter), and i don’t go around worrying about what anyone else is up to either, if trouble comes to my yard that’s where it’ll be buried, otherwise it’s not my concern.
All i’m saying is that it’s a reality and the “powers that be” know that so i’d say a registry is here to stay, which is why i’m of the view of who cares about a registry. i’m more annoyed about the completely useless PTA system which is just a punitive cash grabbing waste of time that could quite easily be done away with without the lawmakers missing out on their database.
In Victoria, PTAs are circa $10 and $58, rounding up, for rifles and handguns, respectively. The handgun PTA, I am convinced is a deterrent (nice try), the rifle PTA is cost of doing business. In fact, in a lot of large companies, every time you call for a (for example) a password reset, your department gets billed a token amount to cover the time (how much is questionable, but that’s what happens).
So, with that in mind, I suspect that they are working to a neutral position. At least for longarms. To basically support their own existence.
So it could well be, at least in Victoria, that this is actually not a cash grabbing system, but instead a highly inefficient system where you do a task, charge for it (salary) and repeat. I doubt there’s profit in there. Just justification for own existence. Pretty sure, NSW is similar. Not sure about other states.
I think you’re onto it.
Up here in Qld it’s about $40 across the board, that wouldn’t cover the wages of the person approving the pta let alone any of the other associated expenses, they must be running at a loss, and clearly can’t afford the staff to run efficiently. I think some idiot came up with the idea to make things difficult & slower to buy a gun but have also shot themselves in the foot because now they cant cope and have made a lot of extra work for themselves which has ended up with them having less of a clue who has what.
If they want money just charge us a purchase fee when we buy the gun over the counter, problem solved & everyone wins.
They could keep the redundant staff on and send them around to clean our guns for us.
Cash cow was definitely not the best term lol the point was merely made to highlight the fact that we pay to run an inefficient system which we have no say over if you know what I mean. Hypothetically It’s like being a financial member of an organisation but not really having a say how it’s run or where best to spend the orgs money or time! But also as @juststarting was saying on a previous comment of mine on another thread that if the registry was defunct it would create Massive waves which I believe but what waves? I haven’t thought about that yet.
That’s not bad between $10 and $40. No wonder our licensing department have bigger and better Christmas parties than the other states, cost’s us $188 per application.
Repealing the registry Is it the first step to dismantle or undermine the NFA because we all know the NFA is not relevant in 2020.
